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Q: How to get an invitation from TCM hospital in Chengdu for acupuncture treatment for french citizen?

My wife is suffering neurologic dystony and hopes to get cured by acupuncture treatment. We have heard Chengdu Hospitals specialists are some of the best in China and would like to undergo treatment for my wife but we need invitation frome the hospital to get the visa.

6 years 5 weeks ago in  Health & Safety - Chengdu

 
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Governor

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How long stay do you plan?

May be the option would be to come on tourist visa and undergo the treatment during your stay.

TCM is not really expensive in China and Chengdu is one of the cheaper cities anyway.

Otherwise you may ask for more information on Chengdu forum:

www.chengduliving.com

Janosik:

One more thing.

Currently the biggest TCM center with Chinese doctors was set up in Hradec Kralove, Czech Republic.

You may consult it with them as this is an official set up with support of Chinese government.

It's set up in University Hospital in Hradec Kralove:

https://www.fnhk.cz/tcm

E-mail: tcm@fnhk.cz

 

6 years 5 weeks ago
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6 years 5 weeks ago
 
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If you want an invitation letter from the hospital then you'll need to contact them. 

 

Ive struggled to find a website for hospitals but the Chengdu university of TCM is renowned and they have affiliated hospitals. 

 

http://eiceo.cdutcm.edu.cn

 

 

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6 years 5 weeks ago
 
Posts: 428

Governor

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How long stay do you plan?

May be the option would be to come on tourist visa and undergo the treatment during your stay.

TCM is not really expensive in China and Chengdu is one of the cheaper cities anyway.

Otherwise you may ask for more information on Chengdu forum:

www.chengduliving.com

Janosik:

One more thing.

Currently the biggest TCM center with Chinese doctors was set up in Hradec Kralove, Czech Republic.

You may consult it with them as this is an official set up with support of Chinese government.

It's set up in University Hospital in Hradec Kralove:

https://www.fnhk.cz/tcm

E-mail: tcm@fnhk.cz

 

6 years 5 weeks ago
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6 years 5 weeks ago
 
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Why would you bother? France has some of the best TCM in the world! Especially when it comes to acupuncture. Plus, you can be guaranteed clean, sterile, good needles!

 

You NEED to understand that during the Cultural Destruction, most TCM practitioners were harassed, tortured, killed... or fled to other countries. France was one of those countries. Some years later, when Mao went "oops", and decided that TCM wasn't so bad, they brought in the 'Barefoot Doctor" system - uneducated, under-trained, and hopeless 'physicians' who were only taught "if you have a headache, needle these points. If you have stomach ache, needle these points". Diagnostics were complete crap! "Differential Diagnosis"* is essential to good treatment!

 

The GOOD TCM lives on in countries outside of China! There is absolutely NOTHING that you can find in China that you won't find in France - except tiger penis and bear claws! All the books have been translated. All the knowledge spread around the world. A lot of the experience as well.

 

Going to a French acupuncturist may also have another great advantage that the Chinese won't - an understanding of western medicine! That is, in particular, drug interactions. Also, a very good understanding of anatomy & physiology - to a medical doctor level (depending on the training).

 

And, lastly, the French acupuncturist is more likely to have knowledge of other treatment protocols outside of TCM that may help, whereas the Chinese will only know of TCM - and not anything about Ayurvedic, homoeopathic, naturopathics, etc etc

 

 

(* why is the headache presenting as a headache? In TCM, there are about 10 different etiologies for 'headache' Some are complete opposites - eg Yang Rising, vs Yin Deficiency.  Sure, you still needle HeGu for both.. but BaiHui is really bad if you've got a Yang/Fire excess!)

Janosik:

I do not know if acupuncture works or not.

It certainly works as a painkiller but this is not the point I want to raise.

 

Irrespective if TCM works or not I find your argumentation that you can find the same quality practitioners in China as well as in the West ridiculous.

 

Even if I accept your argument that in 60ties there were all specialist either murdered or forced to flee into exile, this happened about 50-60 years ago - more than 2 generations ago.

For the last two generations TCM was promoted and people were trained and practiced more than probably any other country in the world.

 

Thinking then that the best of these specialists who had a chance and were encouraged to practice acupuncture every day on masses of patients are then comparable to those in Europe (with may be one or two exceptions) does not sound true.

 

Again, my argument is not to prove TCM and acupuncture works - I just wanted to pint out that I find many flaws in the way how you structured your reply and find your conclusions false. 

6 years 5 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

Does your experience include having been trained in TCM? Mine does.

 

Does yours also include learning of the history of TCM? Mine does.

 

You may find it ridiculous if you like, but unfortunately history is against you.

 

I presume you'd also suggest that China is the BEST acupuncture in the world... and all others should follow China's example? It's not.

 

Your logic also fails... if there was a purge during the devolution (which there was) and the best surviving practitioners left the country to go elsewhere to set up practice and teach, then why would China now have the best TCM practitioners? Surely, the best would be where they went to (ie, USA, UK, France, Australia, etc)

 

Remember, Mao had them killed and their families thrown into abject poverty, and all books burned. Those that survived either hid - and didn't come out again for decades, or went overseas. And, as I mentioned, when Mao did decide "oops, perhaps that wasn't so smart after all", the 'Barefoot Doctor" scheme was implemented - which is a ridiculous bastardisation of the skills and knowledge.

 

Are there going to be good practitioners here in China? Yes, of course. Just as there will be good doctors. But to claim that China's knowledge of TCM is somehow better because it's China is just silly!

 

And, of course, given the way that tertiary (well, any) education is treated in this country, what on earth makes you think that TCM practitioners here would be any more skilled, knowledgeable or competent than any other university trained person? You think TCM colleges don't want hongbaos as much as anywhere else?

 

(And - I'd actually suggest the OP head to Germany if they have the funds.. very good on alternative therapies that have been rigourously tested. Japan also has great TCM)

6 years 5 weeks ago
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Janosik:

No, I have very little knowledge of TCM and therefore do not want to get into arguments if it works ...

I would just oppose that all books were burned - apparently they were not.

For last 40 over years the people were trained in TCM.

I would really assume that in average Chinese acupuncturist should be above average just out of economy of scales.

But would not deny that in Taiwan, Singapore or Japan this cannot be comparable.

Would however argue that in Europe (do not know America) would be on the same level.

I think I read somewhere that acupuncture is provably efficient against pain.

Lately Chinese and Czech ministry of health set up TCM center in official university hospital in Hradec Kralove. 

But the head of Czech MD Chamber heavily protests asking for TCM to be banned - what I want to say the environment in Europe (and this includes also Germany - not sure about France) the environment will not be really neutral and balanced so to say.

6 years 5 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

J - I suggest you actually do some research on the topic, and then get back to me!

 

The biggest problem with TCM in China is the first 2 letters - 'Traditional' and 'Chinese', and they alone are what stops TCM from being particularly good in China... the need for it to be a) traditional, and b) Chinese.

 

Whereas, in other countries, TCM actually gets researched - with real double-blind testing, real control groups. And, real record keeping!

 

You have used one example of a time when a doctor didn't want TCM to be studied (which, FTR, has happened many many times - idiots who already have decided what works and what doesn't). However, if you do actually do some research on the subject, you'll find MANY countries (and, as I said, Germany is one of them, as is the US and UK) doing the research - and have set up GOOD education institutes for teaching this subject.

6 years 5 weeks ago
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First you'll need to discard your logic and any knowledge of medical science and then you'll need to procure a mystical sense of wonder in regards to backwards superstitious horse sh*t.

 

Getting the letter is the easy part.

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6 years 5 weeks ago
 
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If your wife is suffering from a real disease, you should probably get real treatment.

 

TCM is great for rebalancing your chi or whatever, but not proven all that effective for real illnesses.

 

If your wife hopes that acupunture will cure anything, she will be disappointed.

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6 years 5 weeks ago
 
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Interesting how this thread changed into the fight with TCM?

TCM has many aspects and approaches and big part of it relies on the herbs and drugs these herbs contain.

Interestingly enough many type of Western medication tries to reproduce exactly these substances because it's cheaper than to isolate them from the herbs where they are present naturally.

This part of TCM also does not work?

Never mind - I do not want to argue because luckily it's everybody's free choice and those who want to go for TCM treatment can simply do that without any big trouble.

And those who do not want simply will not - it's as simple as this.

Shining_brow:

ALL threads on TCM devolve into the "TCM is garbage" line. I don't bother unless it's the thread is actually about it (although, even then, I prefer people to search the boards first - there's been a number of those threads).

 

For some ridiculous reason, some people seem to think that posting "you're a moron" on a thread is actually going to get them to change their plans. It really is rather insulting! If they don't believe in TCM (or any other debatable subject), telling someone who does isn't going to change anything.

 

"Where is there a mosque in ...?"

"You must be an idiot to believe in Allah!!!"

 

Yeah - that really works!

6 years 5 weeks ago
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