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Q: China's Space Progam , leading the way or catching up?
I am torn between applause and applauded , On one hand good on them for moving things along but on the other hand it is money that could be spent on the starving , homeless and the poor. However that aside will China's efforts have a effect on the rest of the world?
10 years 30 weeks ago in Web & Technology - China
I think you can do both. (applaud and be appalled)
So far they have not done anything that hasn't been done before.... many times.
First a fact. Space exploration is cool. "Rocket scientist" beats any other profession.
Back in the day. US and USSR were competing. Russia's space program is in large in shambles due to lack of funding, but they did develop some sturdy rocket technology that means they still have operations. The US went all in on beating the evil reds, which means their space program is in shambles as it was too expensive.
China will most likely end up with a space program that is cheap compared to the US and Russian programs. (I don't know how the Indian, evil Japan and others compare on price)
What is problematic about the Chinese space program is that they are not doing it for science. It is for soft power. In this day and age it is utterly pointless to send a small space station in orbit. At east not when you do it just to do it. Sending a rover to the moon. Great, but why not people? Maybe because it is also pointless.
I would like to know what the long term strategy of China is on space. Moonbases or what?
Well, they need to find somewhere to put all the garbage, don't they?
China will attempt to land spaceship (lander) and rover simultaneously. It was never done before, as per Chinese teli.
Well, first things first : I've a deep respect for any team able to send rockets into space, safely putting men at the top of them. It's hard, very hard, even if something that is done since 60 years.
But.. Chinese space program redo the steps that have been done 60 years to 40 years ago. And they redo those steps with the currently available machining technologies, modern computers (look at the Apollo LEM computer to get my point), etc. They recycle a lot of existing gear. For instance, the space suits are from the Russians. Space suits took a lot of errors and trials for both USA and Russia to get right. I can pick other examples, like the design of Shenzhou orbiter which is a rehash of the Russian Soyouz orbiter. So yeah, Chinese Space Program does the same for cheaper, but they are still standing on the shoulders of others. None of their designs are originals, they are *very* conservatives. A remote controlled robot on the Moon is way way less challenging the same thing on Mars (transmissions delays, landing on Mars and its thin atmosphere, amount of tricky orbital maneuvers, etc).
So far, their most impressive feat was their previous Moon probe, which definitely showed the engineers know their business. But even that mission did not bring much of new, astounding science. Land something on a Moon of Jupiter or Saturn and I my jaw will fall.
Scandinavian:
Borrowing a good space suit design, is in my mind a good idea. Why waste lots of money developing something you can go buy (or steal)
Sending a rover to the moon. Well OK. I believe the reason NASA is looking to Mars is that they have already been playing enough with the moon to know what there is to know about it. I doubt the Chinese can discover anything new. So this is a bad idea. If they want to go to the moon, do it manned with long term habitation in mind.
DrMonkey:
Agree, reusing the known design is a smart thing to do. My point is, for all the milestones reached by the Chinese Space Program, many of the design effort was already well addressed, in contrast to 50 years ago.
The Moon still have a lot of challenges. For instance, dropping a swarm of robots or some form of miniature factory able to dig a shelter, mine stuffs, make bricks out of the regolite, etc. But indeed, that robot will bring the same pics made in the 60's :p
Most of the great nations of the earth have some spacefaring benchmark to their name. Germany was the first country to reach space (most likely) by testing the V series of rockets before WW2. The Soviets sent the first men into space, even though the first several people were microwaved to death upon reentry and their radio transmissions as they died were beamed all over the world. The US was the first to put a man on the moon. China is aiming to be the first to put a man on Mars. After that, maybe their program will run out of steam too, if it ever happens.
mArtiAn:
You forgot about monkies and dogs; they beat China in the space race. Can't help thinking that wasn't maybe a little bit of a psychological mind-f**k in fact.
Scandinavian:
@martian. Yeah, I think sometime my dog just sits and looks up at the sky, then looks at me with a smug expression. I will typically then point out to him that I funded his plane ticket to travel 8000km from a green clean doggy paradise to a place where he can end up on the dinner plate. This usually ends all discussion.
I'm just wondering how many foreign engineers are working on the program behind the curtains.....
DrMonkey:
Or, how much Chinese trained abroad :p The father of the Long March rockets was trained and worked in US with the best of the best
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qian_Xuesen
If I remember correctly, someone already visited the moon, thus they are catching up, and it will have no effect on the rest of the world. At least not until China claims the moon as their own.
philbravery:
Im betting they will build a manned station there just to piss off everybody else
and charge big time for other country's to visit it.
Scandinavian:
there is already a Stars and Strips on the moon. It would just add to the list of territorial disputes China has.
The space program is having a tremendous effect.
Everyday I see hundreds of space cadets...
It keeps the people of China united in their pride and shows the rest of the world this is a country to reckon with, even if some of us see they are reinventing the wheel.
andy74rc:
I'd better like to see China leading the way to real social reforms to the benefit of the people, and teach Western countries what's like.
Well, space program is gonna be just like everything else in China : with unbeatable competitiveness as long as it only involves ripping old stuff and following old paths. Then the price curb will go exponential the day they'll actually want to get some innovation involved. Won't be worth it, will take ages, and the bill will be much higher in the end than whatever NASA could put on in the meanwhile.
Reason : why worthy Chinese scientists would chose to work in China when they sure are the ones who pick. Patriotic BS don't last long unless the package is worth it (ergo, the prices going up).
according to recent articles, chinese always looking at money, the scientists believe they can one day get uranium and titanium from the moon, since the earth is running out these minerals,
need uranium to run the 105 scheduled nuclear power plants to get rid of coal burning and titanium is expensive and china has no domestic source.
do not think for a minute that china is doing this for pride and mankind, perception is pride but reality is more pragmatic and not spoken very much.
recent article in britain confirmed this for me, now if you excuse me, i need to buy more uranium stocks, the chinese leaders just slipped and let the cat out of the bag and let me know we are running out of uranium, seems the western leaders dont want us to know this.
sometimes what an article does not say is more important than what is says.
TMaster:
Considering space exploration as a mean of securing humanity's future should be a top priority nowadays, but no one considers it seriously for various reasons, mainly economic.
China running out of resources, may it be uranium or whatever, won't be a surprise for anyone, and it won't be a surprise either that China has devoted its efforts into turning its homeland into a sterile wasteland for the best of two decades now, and has been very successful so far.
So, the perspective of scalvaging space's potentially unlimited resources is probably the distant goal of these programs, but for now, the only payoff is face value. And I sincerely don't think the future of space exploration lies in China, just like every other field that requires some degree of actual innovation that you can't steal elsewhere.
