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Q: How long does it take for a China work permit application to expire?
How long does it take for a China work permit application to expire? I signed a contract and the school filed for a work permit, but it was rejected because they filled out the application wrong and didn't properly have documents done. Their visa person had never done a visa before. Then four weeks went by where they didn’t fix it and kept complaining that it was too difficult. I told them to cancel it and they refused. The recruiter who connected me to them said they won’t cancel it unless I go to another one of their schools because he deserves to make money by placing me himself. The school said they can’t cancel it and I will just have to wait and eventually go there. I’m trapped it seems. I was told by friends that I can wait for it to expire but I don’t know how long that takes. Does anyone know? Thanks
48 weeks 1 day ago in Visa & Legalities - China
welcome to China,
prepare to be lied to by your employer, and recruiters are not your friend.
due diligance is required before accepting any job offer and before handing over sensitive personal information like your passport details.
your best option is to discontinue communication with this company as they have most likely not got a licence to hire a foreigner.
do not under any circumstance accept the excuse of arriving on a Tourist Visa which is then to be changed into the appropriate work visa.
this is illegal.
look on this as a learning expereince.
icnif77:
I am imagining ... just ...
You have a native English passport (which I don't ..), you came to China to teach English and you encounter such a BS ... right out off a Chinese employer.
I thought, Chinese would be happy somebody came to teach them new language ... Not just somebody. native English somebody ...
No, let's pull the skin off the gal/guy's back ..., Traditional Chinese scumbaggery had never stopped ...
Oh, well ... lucky some of us, who exited China and never look back ...
That is a typical Chinese style blackmail!
I wouldn't worry for the WP application expiration at all!
WP application doesn't expire. It is either approved or rejected and that is known fairly fast, 2-weeks time the longest.
I'd find another employer, Z visa sponsor ASAP, sign new contract and start with WP application all over again.
You might also try and find out at which office your employer applied for WP and speak to them (.gov) in person. They have at least one person there, who understands and speaks English.
I'd say, your employer most likely never applied for anything.
Employers in China must hold an authorization certificate to hire foreigners. If an employer doesn't have such an authorization, it cannot sponsor foreigner for a Working permit and Z visa.
Most language schools in China don't have such an authorization, because it's a costly thing to obtain for one ...
You could also ask your employer to show you a foreign hire authorization certificate. It's an A4 format paper with text in Mandarin and several red-ish ink stamps.
I've always wanted to see an employer's foreign hire authorization before I've inked the new contract. That prevented many shady deals employers in China were/are playing.
See this:
https://english.www.gov.cn/services/liveandworkinchina
There are two web links on the bottom. Send them a message and find out, if that Chinese state org. can advise and help you.
Good luck!
MarshaBrady1:
I appreciate your detailed reply. Fantastic suggestions!
welcome to China,
prepare to be lied to by your employer, and recruiters are not your friend.
due diligance is required before accepting any job offer and before handing over sensitive personal information like your passport details.
your best option is to discontinue communication with this company as they have most likely not got a licence to hire a foreigner.
do not under any circumstance accept the excuse of arriving on a Tourist Visa which is then to be changed into the appropriate work visa.
this is illegal.
look on this as a learning expereince.
icnif77:
I am imagining ... just ...
You have a native English passport (which I don't ..), you came to China to teach English and you encounter such a BS ... right out off a Chinese employer.
I thought, Chinese would be happy somebody came to teach them new language ... Not just somebody. native English somebody ...
No, let's pull the skin off the gal/guy's back ..., Traditional Chinese scumbaggery had never stopped ...
Oh, well ... lucky some of us, who exited China and never look back ...
Just a follow-up on this question. The same thing happened to my friend who took a job with ZBTI in Ningbo. They lied about what they offered and refused to cancel the work permit. I still can't get an answer on the work permit application but neither can he. I think I will just try somewhere else. Thanks guys
icnif77:
I am telling you, WP application doesn't expire!
Now, once WP is issued as with yer friend-o, that is a different story, i.e. WP must be cancelled or it can be transferred (with minor changes) to a new employer, and issuer (Foreign Expert Bureau) takes care of that.
If you don't/didn't receive other documents for Z visa from your employer, WP application is null and void.
... or in other words, you can apply for the position elsewhere.
Send a message to the link I gave you on the top, and you will get reply about WP and more.
At my time in China, I contacted .gov, i.e. SAFEA at any misunderstandings considering my work in China. However, SAFEA or Foreign Expert Bureau was dismantled at 2017 Labour law changes and I ain't sure, who replaced them. SAFEA was issuing Working permits for laowai.
Returning to your reply .... "I think I will just try somewhere else."
You have to ...! There's no other choice.
You are currently working illegally by the Chinese law. What will you do if PSB (police) raid your place of work?
I'm not sure, how is today with that (illegal work) in China, but pre-2017, cops were raiding the language schools and all wrong visa foreigners were expelled per short notice.
I don't want to sound alarming 'cause if you're in a smaller city, raid most likely won't happened, but still, you never know, do you?
Don't ever think, there will be any blame upon your employer at the police raid. It will be all on you!
At my time in China, I was rather looking for a new, right employer out of Hong Kong than working on a mainland with the wrong, F visa.
While I was in Kaifeng, Henan, in 2015 or so, with the valid Residence permit, I was randomly stopped by cops during a stroll and they've checked my passport and FEC, what stands for Foreign Expert Certificate ...
... and in Xinjiang, checking of documents by cops was a daily occurrence.
Only legal English teaching in China can be under Z visa turned into Residence permit after your return to mainland and working under any other visa put you in cahoots with Chinese law.
I am not in China yet. I won't go without a work permit. I thought I could go back after covid then this happened.
icnif77:
Great! I thought, you're already working in China.
If the employer is telling you " ... come to China with L - Tourist or F - Business visa ..." don't go for it as Sorrel said above.
It is impossible to convert L or F to Z visa inside China. You will be required to exit China, return to your home country's Chinese embassy to get Z - Working visa and then return back to China.
The thingy is, any other visa than Z is easier and less costly to get,
Make employer send you all documents necessary for Z visa, apply at Chinese embassy and enter China only with the Z visa!
So, again ... who cares for the expiration of WP application ... your potential employer and recruiter are both feeding you with bunch of crapola! I just don't understand what's their angle, i.e. if you don't hold a license for foreign hire, why even a bother foreign teacher ..., 'cause if you have foreign hire license, you can have a foreign teacher working at your school in 30-days after the first interview ... It might be some kind of Chinese reaching with R hand around the arse to the L pocket thingy.
Get new employer, who'll sponsor only proper working - Z visa!
Good luck!
Thanks! Great advice. Yeah this makes no sense. I talked to 4 recruiters, two visa experts, and a lawyer in China. They all said the work permit application locking me in is a thing now. It's really tough to get a response from SAFEA right now but I'm trying. The lawyer literally said it would be cheaper to bribe them than to hire him to get them to cancel the application. It all sounds like BS and if this is their opinion then I might really be done trying to go back.
sorrel:
sorry, but you completely wasted your time talking to other recruiters, visa experts and lawyers, especially if they are chinese.
most don't know what the law is and are probably fishing for money from you in one way shape or form, especially the one who mentioned bribes.
bottom line, you should have just gone ahead and just ignored the recruiter who ghosted you and applied for other positions.
China is not worth the hassle of trying to work in these days.
there are coutries that are easier to deal with in terms of application process and overall honesty.
icnif77:
100+ @Sorrel!
SAFEA doesn't exist anymore ... since 2017. It was replaced by some other name governmental office.
Find out where your employer filled WP application and ... we'll see further when you'll get the name of new Foreign Expert Bureau.
If I'd be you (OP), I wouldn't talk to anybody, especially not to Chinese recruiters and lawyers ... to find out what?.
Find another Z visa sponsor and start all over again ... and if old WP is still valid and what not .. BS Chinese are feeding you, you will find out with new employer, Z visa sponsor.
Have you seen a Foreign Hire license of your employer? ... I know ... right!
Q:
Here's my situation. The recruiter has submitted my documents for getting a work permit notification letter. They say it usually takes about 2 weeks to receive the notification. It's been around 11-12 working days and still no feedback. Is this normal and do I have to keep waiting for it?
icnif77:
Sounds very shady to me. However, I am a China old timer, so who knows ...
Recruiters can now hire and apply for Z visa documents?
At my time (pre -2017), employer had to hold a license for foreign hire and only then employer could apply for foreign worker's WP ...
Similar rule applies to all hotels in China. Only some hotels can house laowai, i,e, only if they hold gov.'s foreign housing authorization.
That is the reason only the most expensive hotels in China will accept foreigner ...
I was just wondering ... why you all native English passport holders even bother with China and all problems with starting documentation?
If all this what OP wrote latest about WP expiration is true, you've been held hostage after you've inked the contract. For what?
Go elsewhere. English teaching world is wide open for a native English speakers ...
They're looking for you just in about every corner of the world!
If I'd have a native English passport, I'd go to Cuba, first ... and a bit later to Iran ... Iranian women are so gorgeousitas ...
sorrel:
i agree,
I would not look to China for work for so many reasons.
there are easier and more accessible countries to work in.
the way recruiters treat potential employees in China is symptomatic of how they will be treated (should then every reach there)
icnif77:
I was saying a month or so ago, that whatever I'm concern with a non-English native passport, it might be easier to apply at NASA for the Moon program than to get a decent ET job, but now it looks the same applies for a native English passport holders in China, too.
You have to ask yourself " ... for what?".
To provide benefits to a foreign country's residents by teaching them your worldly popular language ...
... and once you'll start to work, you'll have to argue with your employer because disrespect of the signed and stamped contract.
I mean, if I'd be an employer, I would be honoured and more than happy, you came to my country and school ... and not stiff you at anything I promised on the working contract while you were still in your home country.
You have to grasp: "Ohh, c'mon ... !"
I guess, work at the horse farm must be more rewarding despite the smell ... 
... 
"add-it:"
... a few hours later ...
"I ain't sure, where did I get the last sentence comparison, but it cracks me up ..."
So I took some of your advice, ghosted the school, and found another job. They literally sent me a screenshot where if they try to start an application in the work permit system - it says I already have an application open with the original school. So yes, they trapped me. WTF
sorrel:
"The way recruiters treat potential employees in China is symptomatic of how they will be treated "
China is not worth the hassle of trying to work in these days.
there are countries that are easier to deal with in terms of application process and overall honesty."
You would be better off not returning to China (you said in an earlier comment
"I might really be done trying to go back. "
Anyone who has ever worked in China knows that foreign workers are very likely to be cheated as a matter of course, so you can not have been unaware that you were potentially getting to be treated badly. By your own admission in the original question, the original recruiter had no intention of placing you where you wanted to work. They are holding you hostage and I certainly would not want to work for a place that did that. Remember, when you ask for advice and act on what you hear, don't blame the people on this site who replied as you are the one responsible for your choices and actions. if I were you now I would just move on and not even bother trying to return to China -
China is not worth the hassle of trying to work in these days.
There are countries that are easier to deal with in terms of application process and overall honesty."
To be honest I would not have even tried to work in China again.
The way recruiters treat potential employees in China is symptomatic of how they will be treated (should then every reach there)"
Look on this as a learning experience and move on.
On the positive side, this whole experience has probably saved you a lot of grief, as if you returned to China with the original recruiter, you would be blackmailed and exploited as they would deem to be having the upper hand, and any recruiter willing to do that to an employee is certainly not to be trusted, so I suspect you have made a lucky escape.
Good luck !
Of course I don't blame anyone. A wise person listens and accepts feedback. I just wanted to give an update on what happened. Interesting....
icnif77:
The things about foreign (English) teaching had certainly changed to the worse ... then when I was there.
However, even in my time (pre -2017), I've always measured teaching of English more as a good will gesture than a great, good paying job opportunity .., so I didn't tolerate any abuse from my employers.
I had very simple working 'recipe':
"If I respect signed contract 100%, I demand my employer behaves the same!"
Once, I quit the contract because I didn't have a teli in my apartment as per contract. SAFEA helped me and they even suggested new employer at the end .
I opened the thread here at the time of happening ... It was the contract with Helen Group from Hangzhou, which I signed just 'cause I got tired of HK's congestion.
I knew from my previous experience with Helen Group, I'll soon find a reason to abandon the contract and find new, better employer without exiting China.
Under these circumstances as you describe now, I would simply exit China and go elsewhere.
When in China, I would always imagine like I'd go for a voluntary blood donation and at the end I'd have to pay for the chair I was sitting on ... during the procedure.
Think, how it would all turn out, if you would be already in China ... or in other words, lucky you, you aren't!
.
